http://www.donu-tech.com/alert.html
Please don't tell sKally.
We are not out there. We are HERE!
Jerry, President
Donu-Tech
Eusebius Hieronymus
JoinedPosts by Eusebius Hieronymus
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Sci-Fi Fans Only: A.I.
by Maximus ini hear tell there are some aficionados out there.. as a young man i secretly loved ray bradbury, isaac asimov, l. sprague decamp, poul anderson, arthur c. clarke and others.
loved brian aldiss' "super-toys last all summer.".
when the movie "2001: a space odyssey" premiered, i sneaked into a theater all by myself, and was blown away.
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Eusebius Hieronymus
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Freedom of Thought and JW Opposers
by dunsscot indoes freedom of thought really obtain in this forum?
are those who have left god's organization and jehovah god himself actually now more open-minded and unbiased?
if those who espouse atheistic thoughts or those who believe every vile utterance spoken against jehovah's people think they are now speaking from some olympian perspective, i beg to differ.
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Eusebius Hieronymus
A couple of simple questions?
What would the learned theologian Rudolf Bultmann have said about a belief system that allows innocent children to bleed to death, literally, to show a symbolic "respect for the sanctity of life"?
Does the upper-echelon Witness code of silence for perpetrators of pedophilia show evidence that "human thought itself is contradictory in nature as it ascends toward the ultimate pinnacle of cognition?" My sense of humanity transcends philosophical acceptance of such repugnant behavior.
What would Descartes think about an organization that says "Don't think, we'll tell you what to think"?
You conclude JWs are not wrong in such a religious outlook?
Ignore such fundamental truths at your own peril. JWs are certain NOT in the same epistemological boat as the groups you mention, who simply do not exhibit the same rigid, inflexible high-control behaviors.
Jerome
"I doubt, therefore I am" -
31
The CO's visit
by OrangeBlossom inthis past week was the visit of our circuit overseer.
i know what you are thinking so before i post some of his comments that i personally found interesting, i only went to keep peace in the family and not give rise to suspicion about my true feelings.
so with that said, here are some things that grabbed my attention.. 1) his talk thursday nite was about being successful and how the world's view of success is far different than the organizations.
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Eusebius Hieronymus
How'd you like to be a thinking CO and have to peddle that drivel, outlines given to them to be followed carefully by "the Society," now the Christian Congregation, Legal/Service? Originating with the "faithful slave," of course.
Elders, check the letterhead on your invitations to KM School and on policy letters that used to come from "the Society."
They are going to lose even more than the 23,000 men who have been part of the elder exodus over the last three years. Whoever said the organization is going to become a "flat earth" society has got it about right.
Jerry
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Nourishment for the Spirit
by Maximus inmy observation is that persons who 1) heal/adjust the most rapidly from their jw experience and 2) seem to have the most joy in life are those who read, read, read, in pursuit of what i call nourishment for the spirit.
i've really enjoy the pithy aphorisms you use here, which suggests you've distilled some wisdom from somewhere.
i'm going to ask your help in this thread.
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Eusebius Hieronymus
Marilyn, the full title of the book is
"The Dancing Wu Li Masters: An Overview of the New Physics"Not about channeling. Metatron in a post above says it caused him to think about pantheism. For those who are mystified by the title:
At an Esalen Institute meeting in 1976, tai chi master Al Huang said that the Chinese word for physics is Wu Li, "patterns of organic energy." Gary Zukav and the others present developed the idea of physics as the dance of the Wu Li Masters--the teachers of physical essence. Zukav explains the concept further:
The Wu Li Master dances with his student. The Wu Li Master does not teach, but the student learns. The Wu Li Master always begins at the center, the heart of the matter .... This book deals not with knowledge, which is always past tense anyway, but with imagination, which is physics come alive, which is Wu Li .... Most people believe that physicists are explaining the world. Some physicists even believe that, but the Wu Li Masters know that they are only dancing with it.
The "new physics" of Zukav's 1979 book comprises quantum theory, particle physics, and relativity. Even as these theories age they haven't percolated all that far into the collective consciousness; they're too far removed from mundane human experience not to need introduction.
It was an early introduction (that I did not pay enough attention to then) to the most profound and mind-altering insights of 20th-century science.
Didn't want to see anyone turned off this exceptional book recommended by several above because of thinking it is linked to channeling. (Hate the old "you said, quote ... weird ... unbelievable," so I'll do it this way. Not to have a precise memory for old book titles is more than understandable.)
Best,
Jerry
Who appreciates the Wu Li masters now in his life -
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District Assembly Experience on Volunteering
by AlanF ini seem to recall that on this summer's district assemblies there is an experience given about a woman who was involved in various voluntary community services, but quit them and became a pioneer.
does anyone remember this?
if so, can anyone provide more solid documentation?.
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Eusebius Hieronymus
This was a "canned" experience used universally, as are all such, and will be picked up by anyone who has or is yet to attend. Same story, identically re-enacted or told, to seem more interesting than mere reading. Might be interesting to tape record --
-- and compare with the recent Awake! magazine commending volunteerism! Bet the lady is shocked when she reads this one! Ah, but the Society can trot out that article when approaching certain governments.
Waiting to read your expose on the hypocrisy of it all.
Jerry
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Nourishment for the Spirit
by Maximus inmy observation is that persons who 1) heal/adjust the most rapidly from their jw experience and 2) seem to have the most joy in life are those who read, read, read, in pursuit of what i call nourishment for the spirit.
i've really enjoy the pithy aphorisms you use here, which suggests you've distilled some wisdom from somewhere.
i'm going to ask your help in this thread.
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Eusebius Hieronymus
Waiting, I got the poem from Maximus, who said it is by "Brini."
My way of support to everyone here, especially hurting newcomers, and to him while he is going through a rough patch just now.
Want to get the titles right, but don't have access to them just now. Thanks for your kindness when I first got on the board, waiting. An oasis in the jungle, survival of the fittest and all that.
Mrs. Ozzie, your post was positively profound. The pericope from John is one of my favorite passages of the Bible. Yancey is great, would that I could read all of his many books. A reminder I need to go back and read him with new eyes.
I know this is the reason for the thread, to expose many to what really fine, uplifting thoughts are available in great abundance--on a wide variety of subjects, including science, which is not mutually exclusive to faith.
I am greatly impressed not just by the first-rate heads here, but the equally capacious hearts.
Jerry
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Nourishment for the Spirit
by Maximus inmy observation is that persons who 1) heal/adjust the most rapidly from their jw experience and 2) seem to have the most joy in life are those who read, read, read, in pursuit of what i call nourishment for the spirit.
i've really enjoy the pithy aphorisms you use here, which suggests you've distilled some wisdom from somewhere.
i'm going to ask your help in this thread.
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Eusebius Hieronymus
May You always Feel loved,
May you find serenity and tranquility
in a world you may not always
understand.May the pain you have known
and the conflict you have experienced
give you the strength to walk through life
facing each new situation
with optimism and courage.Always know that there are those
whose love and understanding will always
be there, even when you feel most alone.May you discover enough goodness in others
to believe in a world of peace.
May a kind word, a reassuring touch,
a warm smile be yours every day of your life,
and may you give these gifts as well as receive them.Remember the sunshine when the storm seems unending.
Teach love to those who know hate, and let that love
embrace you as you go into the world.May the teaching of those you admire
become part of you, so that you may
call upon them.Remember, those whose lives you have touched
and who have touched yours are always a part of you,
even if the encounters were less than
you would have wished.May you not become too concerned
with material matters, but instead place
immeasurable value on the goodness in your heart.Find time in each day to see the beauty
and love in the world around you.Realize that each person has limitless abilities,
but each of us is
different in our own way.What you may feel you lack in one regard
may be more than compensated for
in another.What you feel you lack in the present
may become one of your strengths in
the future.May you see your future
as one filled with promise and possibility.Learn to view everything
as a worthwhile experience.May you find enough inner strength
to determine your own worth by yourself,
and not be dependent on another's judgements
of your accomplishments.May you always feel loved.
+++++++++++
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LIES in Current Watchtower!
by Eusebius Hieronymus inafter posting on the maximus nourishment for the spirit thread about elaine pagel's "the origin of satan" and "adam, eve, and the serpent," i check my mail and find the watchtower for august 15, and a qfr (whole page) answering the question, "for how long a period of time did job suffer.".
they say "job's suffering and its resolution may have occurred within a few months, perhaps less than a year.
" blah, blah, tribulation momentary and light, blah, blah, christ will himself finish your training.
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Eusebius Hieronymus
After posting on the Maximus Nourishment for the Spirit thread about Elaine Pagel's "The Origin of Satan" and "Adam, Eve, and the Serpent," I check my mail and find the Watchtower for August 15, and a QFR (whole page) answering the question, "For how long a period of time did Job suffer."
They say "Job's suffering and its resolution may have occurred within a few months, perhaps less than a year." Blah, blah, tribulation momentary and light, blah, blah, Christ will himself finish your training. What is the point of all this? Your suffering will be over SOON NOW?
They cite the New World Translation: "Now it came to be _the day_ when Job's sons and daughters ..." From this literalism they conclude: "It seems that all of this [suffering of loss] occurred on one day."
GOOD GOD! What do they do with the Genesis "day" in which God created the heavens and the earth? Make it literal again too??
The NRSV accurately says: "One day when ..." No kidding! Anyone have access to other translations?
What is the deal here? What are they trying to say? Having read some scholarly works on Job, including the Jerome Bible Handbook, I feel like I am reading a child's paraphrase hardly at high school level. A whole QFR? In 23 million issues???
Royally pissed at that one, I look at the main article, what seems to be a nice backgrounder on Abraham, man of faith. Sprinkled with gems about the Near East time period. "Upbuilding."
Then we get this horse manure: "We may have opposition from unbelieving family members, including disfellowshipped relatives, who might try to lure us into unwholesome association. Abram thus set a fine example for us. He put friendship with Jehovah ahead of everything--even family ties. He did not know exactly how, when, or where God's promises would be fulfilled. Still, he was willing to stake his life on those promises." Page 16.
AAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaahhhhhhhh!!!!
Doesn't the Public Information spin doctor office say that disfellowhipping does not sever ties? Bet you the hardnosers in the field will quote this Watchtower chapter and verse!
After the body parts and racial wars, does anybody have any energy left to discuss these points? I'm just going to start the thread. Have got lots more reading to do.
Mad as hell,
Jerry
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Canadian Anglican Church Bankrupt Due to Lawsuits
by Defender inhttp://www.nationalpost.com/home/story.html?f=/stories/20010706/611059.html
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Eusebius Hieronymus
Would the Governing Body ever personally apologize for its mistakes? 'Fess up? Say they need to repent? Publicly acknowledge and recognize past failures? Say the first step is telling the truth? Say "Pray that we may all perceive the need for our own healing"?
Stopped laughing yet?
The head of the Anglican Church of God did, in an open letter read aloud in every congregation of that church last year!He said: "Healing never happens if we ignore the wounds. The first step is truth-telling -- recognizing and acknowledging past failures."
"We have an obligation, and a will born of our desire to be just, to account for past injustice."
"We have an obligation, and a will born of our desire to be just, to account for past injustice.
"Healing also requires being prepared to turn and walk in a different
direction. Indeed repentance means 'turning around'. The wounds of past
prejudices, injustices and broken trust will never be healed unless we
'strive for justice and peace among all people, and respect the dignity of
every human being.'"
Would the GB make statements like that? A filthy Babylonish "Christian" whore sure did. The GB lies about its mortal enemy, and many of us have believed their falsehood that Catholicism and other religions hide pedophiles and have no enlightened policies. Bet that will be spotlighted.But then, are you seeing their new coziness with the U.N.?
Cynical today,
JerryDocument from my files for those who want more than the bite, courtesy of another poster: Letter
[start quotation]
to be read in congregations of the Anglican Church of Canada, as permitted
by the Diocesan bishop, on Sunday, May 28, 2000.
Dear brothers and sisters in Christ:
I write to share something of this moment in the life of the Anglican Church
of Canada. In this troubling time we are faced with litigation so costly as
to change radically our structures and our life as a national church. But
the time is also profoundly hopeful; God leads us ever deeper into the path
of healing and new life.
Simply put: resulting from abuse in the residential schools, there are over
1600 claims of varying kinds brought against the General Synod of the
Anglican Church of Canada. About one hundred cases involve the proven abuse
of children, and the perpetrators are in prison. The costs of litigation and
settlements for these alone is sufficient to exhaust all the assets of the
General Synod and of some dioceses involved.
What does this mean? For the national church, the way we presently carry out
our mission will be modified. We are negotiating with the federal government
in order to find alternatives to litigation by which we can make a just
contribution to compensation. We will know in a few months if an agreement
is possible. However, whether or not this is achievable, we will be a very
different Church.
Where in this do I discern hope? At the heart of it, we trust God is with us
in the choices we face, that we will find new ways to carry out our shared
mission and that we will continue to work for healing and reconciliation.
Healing and reconciliation is our first and clearly-affirmed goal. Both the
Council of General Synod and the House of Bishops gave it the strongest
possible support in meetings earlier this month. The legacy of the schools
has been deeply wounding. Healing never happens if we ignore the wounds. The
first step is truth-telling -- recognizing and acknowledging past failures.The Anglican Church of Canada collaborated with the Government of Canada in
a policy that brought pain to many individuals and despair in many
communities. That injury continues into the present. We have an obligation,
and a will born of our desire to be just, to account for past injustice.
Healing also requires being prepared to turn and walk in a different
direction. Indeed repentance means "turning around". The wounds of past
prejudices, injustices and broken trust will never be healed unless we
"strive for justice and peace among all people, and respect the dignity of
every human being". Ever since the General Synod of 1969 set us in a new
direction, aboriginal and non-aboriginal Anglicans have been learning to
walk together in a different way. I assure aboriginal brothers and sisters
that we will not be deflected from this road. I call each of us to recommit
ourselves to that path, so that together we may find the healing Christ
offers in his Cross and Resurrection.
I want to assure all Anglicans that what is at risk financially are our
assets, not the contributions that provide for the ongoing ministry and
mission of the church at parish, diocesan or national levels. Your
contributions serve the mission of the church -- not the costs of
litigation. If our present structures cease to exist, we will find a way for
our contributions to continue to serve that work.How do we continue authentically if the depletion of our assets means we are
unable to meet the claims against us? I believe that our greatest asset in
the Anglican Church of Canada is our ability to be in relationship, to
support and care for each other. This will survive. So will our capacity to
worship, to learn, to grow, to serve and to bear witness to Christ. Nothing
at the heart of our faith -- our desire for wholeness and healing in
ourselves, in our relationships, in our country and in our world -- is at
risk. We have these abundant and enduring assets that will help us continue
to do justice and work for healing. As we move into the future, I ask for
your prayers: for the bishops and people of Cariboo and Qu'Appelle dioceses
who are most immediately concerned; for the Anglican Council of Indigenous
Peoples who give outstanding leadership, and who bear such love for the
whole of the Church; for those whose ministries are given over to witness in
the courts. Pray that we may all perceive the need for our own healing.
We read in the gospels how Jesus speaks of things ending -- of the heavens
and earth in turmoil. In one sense, it is a picture of chaos. But Jesus says
that it is more truly to be interpreted as a birth: ".when these things
begin to take place, stand up and raise your heads, because your redemption
is drawing near." (Luke 21:28) For many in the church, things are being
shaken, and it feels like chaos. But we stand up and raise our heads; God is
present and leads us into something new.When we look up at the evening horizon, we see the sun falling. Turn the
other way, and we will see it rise. I believe with all my heart, and with
sure confidence, that God is with us both in the falling and in the rising,
and that, even in our dying, God will bring us to new life.
(Signed)
+Michael
Archbishop and Primate -
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Nourishment for the Spirit
by Maximus inmy observation is that persons who 1) heal/adjust the most rapidly from their jw experience and 2) seem to have the most joy in life are those who read, read, read, in pursuit of what i call nourishment for the spirit.
i've really enjoy the pithy aphorisms you use here, which suggests you've distilled some wisdom from somewhere.
i'm going to ask your help in this thread.
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Eusebius Hieronymus
I was pointed to a head-slamming, instructive book on "Adam, Eve, and the Serpent," by Elaine Pagels, Princeton Theological. An introduction into how the message of Christian freedom got converted to a dour doctrine of sin, redemption, the Fall. How did that minority opinion get adopted and become a force that has shaped Western civilization for millennia? Details, careful reasoning, and a close look at St. Augustine who believed that sin was transmitted via semen and that we are all infected thereby.
She also wrote "The Origin of Satan" and "The Gnostic Gospels." The former sets out the scholarly view of the Hebrew mind, which encompassed no devilish entity. The Book of Job is of Persian roots, with its Good God vs. Bad God symbolism, and barely made it into the Bible canon.
Better get some exact titles, I'll add them later. I've gone through dozens recently, after a very long time of running on autopilot myself.
Jerry